Martial arts or plain fist fighting?

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I dunno bout that. Arnold & ol Jesse Ventura both run parts of this country & I would think they could hold their owm, well at least back in their prime anyway.

True enough, but surely you recognize that they're the exception, and not the rule. The ability to fight is a skill that has few marketable applications.

Yeah I agree that they're the exceptions. They are exceptions to pretty much everything.I definately dont support fighting, but it does have its perks. For example professional fighters make a pretty nice paycheck every night, and I bet that most of them got their start at a young age. And on another note, try telling that to the lil kid always getting bullied. I bet he wishes he could defend himself.I'm not sure where you're from but around here fighting is just part of every day life. You ever seen the movie Fight Club? Where a group of guys get together & fight for the fun of it? That's kinda the way it is around here. I mean nobody lets it get outta hand, but fightin is one of the best ways to get into shape.And to touch on what you said, most of the leaders of this country cant really fight, but they have an assload of security that can and will .I geuss I just grew up around it, so it doesnt bother me. Just the way I raised I geuss.

Powerlifter - Yeah, but you gotta figure they only have to fall for it ONCE. Also, you're right, I never came across an experienced wrestler...I think I would lose against them, because I can't fight for shit on the ground. BTW, my neighborhood is like yours, kinda...me and my brother fight some friends of ours sometimes for fun. We don't hit each other in "vital points" (like mostly everything I mentioned in my last post) but everything else is OK.

Stonev1 - Kick some ass, dude. ^_^ Just don't abuse what I taught you...if someone pisses you off, just tell him if he wants to start a fight, all he has to do is push you. He probably will, and as soon as his hands touch your chest, proceed with the asswhooping. (Kind of gives you a reason...you can say he provoked it ^_^)

*EDIT*
Dude, I have a better idea. When he pushes you, pretend like you're really soft, and just look at him...then turn around, and act like your gonna walk away. This makes the opponent a little less tense, and he won't expect what comes next...A SWING FROM HELL!! Turn around while swinging, make sure it connects, and he will probably go sprawling backward, eventually to the ground. I've seen this one done before by my friend, and it was BEAUTIFUL...His fist had STARS around it, it was so pretty lol. Just make sure you don't hit anyone else but him when you turn around and swing :P.

Websexinfo - I assure you that he probably wanted to kill me. So it was either him, or me. Also, he started the fight. If you knew me in real life, you would know that I don't go around picking fights...but I'm not gonna let someone take advantage of me. If you're okay with fighting but you're not okay with killing someone, then you shouldn't be fighting. You can kill someone by hitting them in the wrong spot accidentally, so you have to be prepared for anything. BTW, the dude didn't die...lucky bitch :P.

Steppenwolf - I'm not telling everyone to go around beating people up now that they know this. I assume that everyone will use my knowledge ONLY IN SELF-DEFENSE...You guys are smarter than to pick fights. Like I said earlier, fighting doesn't solve SHIT...but don't stand there and take hits either.

Yeah bro, that turn around technique reminds me of what a guy did to me one night at the bar. He walked up to me & was like "Wassup J? Man it's been a while since I seen you. How you been?" Then he reached out to shake my hand. I had no idea who this guy was, but I didnt wanna be an ass you know. SO I reached out & started to shake his hand. Well as soon as I grabbed his hand, he got a firm grip & pulled me to him. AT the same time he swung at me, and I'll be damn if he didnt catch me right across my cheek. I wont lie either I think that's was by the far the worst lick I've ever taken from a guy smaller than me. LOL, but all it did was piss me off & I threw his ass outta the bar. I gotta give him his props though cause that was one hell of a sucker punch.Well I asked around & found out that there's was a bet to see who could kick my ass. Only one guy had the balls to try & he woulda got $100 if he woulda won. LOL, I didnt know guys hated bouncers that much .

In reply to: If you're okay with fighting but you're not okay with killing someone, then you shouldn't be fighting Actually, I'm not okay with fighting. I find it crucial for someone to know how to fight so they can get away from the person who is starting the fight. I've been in a few fights myself, but I usually resort to psychological warfare instead.

For the original poster:Don't listen to all of these guys saying this works, that doesn't. Everyone thinks their style is the best and they could beat up anyone. I've heard it 1000 times. My roomate just limped back from his mma fight with a black eye, stitches, and a swollen foot (got KO'd in under 5 minutes) and he thought he could beat up everyone too.As for Powerlifter talking smack about high kicks... Have you every seen Mirko Cro-Cop fight? He would probably knock you out with a high kick.A lot of martial arts get reputations based on who trains in them, which has little to do with the value of the art. For example, most wrestlers are very athletic, since wrestling is a competetive sport, and the ones who weren't as good were cut from the teams. Only the best continued to wrestle. Most traditional martial artists in the US are guys who didn't play sports, and this was an activity that they could do outsided of school, since the dojos accept everyone and don't make cuts. Therefore, the avereage traditional martial artist in the US would probably get waxed by the average wrestler, simply because the wrestler would most likely be the much better athlete. The same goes for other competetive combat sports like boxing, kickboxing, muy thai, etc. If Tae Kwon Do was a the most popular high school sport, and they made cuts; and wrestling was something average guys did after school at the YMCA; most TKD guys would beat up most wrestlers.What I'm saying, is that it's the person more than the art. To be able to fight, you need to be in shape, strong, fast, and agile, just like any other sport. Many traditional martial artists train their technique but never really train their conditioning and power, thus getting beat up by very fit boxers and wrestlers.In summary, any art, style, or training will help you to be a better fighter, but there is no magic pill, or secret fighting technique. It all takes hard work sweat and training, and in the end, the bigger guy will still probably win. Try to avoid getting in fights and you will reduce your chances of getting beat up, hurt, or killed.Oh yeah, and height does matter. If powerlifter tried to fight someone with equal skill and athleticism as him, that was 4 inches taller, he would get owned. Height won't make up for lack of skill and athleticism though, but all things being eqaul, it is a bonus.

After reading my last post, I should add that I don't train in TKD, but I think it get's a bad rap because a lot of "nerdy" type guys train in it. Those "nerdy" type guys are still better fighters due to their training, but that type of training alone isn't going to help them beat up big bulky guys. You usually don't see "nerdy" unathletic guys who are wrestlers becuase they get cut from the team and never get to wrestle. It doesn't mean that wrestling automatically makes you superior. In fact, if you are fairly unathletic and weak, you are probably better trying to land one good strike to a vital target, than grabbing someone and trying to choke him out.

First off height doesnt matter. I dont care what anyone says. Height is an advantage while standing-up becuase you have an obvious reach advantage. However, when you get on the ground height is nothing. I've fought several guys 4" taller than me. Hell, I fought a guy 6" taller than me & WON. You put someone 4" taller than me in the same shape & same experience level I gaurantee you he wont "own" me. He'll damn sure have his hands full.

Now with that aside, why'd you bring up an old topic to post basically what was already said? And secondly, what makes you think you're the expert on this subject?

I know this is off topic but this is what I think of fighting. :stuck_out_tongue_winking_eye:

Fighting is not something you can avoid (depending on your situation) and if you walk away or run youll only be thought of as a pussy :stuck_out_tongue_winking_eye:
over here usually when someone loses a fight or gets jumped there definately going to try and get revenge.. so what I think is that a fight leads to bigger things, for example. someone gets jumped, then the guy who got jumped get their crew and look for the guys who jumped him, big group fight, I've seen peoples families getting involved over stupid sh*t, this one fool threatened the guy he has beef with that if he doesn't come an fight him hes gonna go to his house drag his dad out of the house and beat him, also it can lead to knives/straps getting invlolved(dont want that to happen :stuck_out_tongue_winking_eye:)
Just my opinion on fighting :laughing:

Also.. is it just me or are guns ALOT EASIER to get a hold of thesedays? I see alot of people w/ straps lately.

I think you can avoid fighting in ALMOST all situations.

websex is right. In 90% of the cases fighting can be avoided; however, male ego & pride is a strong, crazy thing. I'm a perfect example. I will try to talk things out the best way I can, but as soon as someone threatens or insults me - there's no way I'm walkin away. Another thing, if someone calls me out I'm going to go meet him. In both of those cases a person could act like he didnt hear the insults & leave or then just not come to the fight. For some reason I cant do either. I geuss you can say I'm stubborn.

In the end, combat is about the will and mentality of the combatants. Someone who can remain calm and act decisively will win 9/10 encounters. I train in the martial arts more as an outlet and means of keeping my mind/body connection as tight as possible. I like TKD, kickboxing, Hapkido, etc. They're enjoyable and fantastic workouts, but only certain aspects of each are remotely applicable in a streetfight. The key is always walking away if you can, as most people are not worth the trouble or time. I would not ever start a fight. My philosophy on self defense is to inflict as much harm as possible, as quickly as possible, in order to end the encounter before it escalates and minimize any legal ramifications. A quick smash of the instep or hyperextension of a knee or elbow is better than a prolonged, stand-up fist fight. The longer you're fighting, the more that can go wrong. A good, disciplined streetfighter/boxer will be just as dangerous in a bar as a 7th dan black belt trained in the heart of South Korea. It's all about poise and timing. Personally, Hapkido seems the best martial art for close combat in such an environment, but it is also designed to be the most catastrophic, which can lead to some big problems in the legal department.

i did the martial arts scene for 2 years and still kept loosing fights. btw im about 5"7 like 130ish not very big. anyways the best advice i can give you if your getting into fights is to take up boxing. i started a few months back and i am getting pretty damn good. watch out when you got into those gyms too. i sparred against a kid 3 years younger and 6"s shorter and he was alot better than i. the martial arts can be very useful but you have to stick with them for years. you cant just go for a few months and expect to kick ass. however since ive gotten into boxing ive never got in ne real street fights. i hated doing boxing at first beacuse i was the only white kid in there but i used that to my advantage. im not against whites but the blacks at the gym are better than ne one else in ther. so you learn off of the good fighters then when you go back and fight the skool kids they dont stand a chance. but keep in mind your gonna get ur nose and mouth busted a few times learning. alot more violent than martial arts training in my exp. but like they say no pain no gain

Fist fighting a.k.a. street fighting, street fighters have no rules, but martial arts have alot of rules, street fighters would kick a martial artists assquik, but still its good to learn it just dont forget your street fighting skills.

Well I can tell you from tkaing tae Kwon Do for many years, it'll help you out in many aspects of life. It helps you mentally and physically. I no longer take classes but when I wa sin class I was in the best shape physically and mentally.When it comes to defense, there have been a few times I had to use my techniques to get out of a bad situation.

Dude, cartman, why do you keep responding to these old old posts?

Being a martial artist (yes, I do it for a living), I can conclude one thing. There is no best martial art, only the more practical.

Boxing, Muay Thai, MMA, JKD, Judo, Sambo, Pro-Wrestling and all those more violent are the only ones you can actually use in street fight situations.

All those others, TKD, Karate, Aikido and definitely almost all of the 7 millions of Gung Fu's sucks. It's just a good exercise but you'll be screaming WTF?? when you deliver the Kote Gaeshi (Aikido), and he comes up stares at you and give you a suplex that gives you permanent brain damage.

Trust me, I'm a martial art fanatic since young and I have a lot of MMA experience cuz going to different Kwoons, Dojo, Dojongs, lalala, schools, whatever you call them, etc and actually talk with the teacher about real life situation application of what you learn.

I once went to a Tae Kwon Do school and talk to the teacher about real life application. After a while, I sparred a bit with one of the top student and he kicked me about at thigh height, I took him down to the floor, twisted his arm and punched lightly on the back of his head. After that day, I say before I sleep, Tae Kwon Do is just fancy crowd pleasers. Another event I sparred with my Aikido black belt friend. I stuck to jabbing and didn't use any balance commited moves, he kicked me in the leg and I asked him; WTF was that? He said: Karate, cuz you don't lunge at me. See? Most arts been invented by idiots who THINKS it works but never actually put it into practice.

Some of you may come and argue saying Tae Kwon Do doesn't sucks, but history has proven it is indeed useless when there is no rule, no restriction of style. Most of the earliest UFC tournaments, the tae kwon do men lost in the first round. They didn't even put up a fight.

To be honest, art is art. But Art can not win over Brute Force of grapplers, proffessional boxers, Muay Thai practitioners or Jeet Kune Do men.

You probably gonna say, but Morishiba Ueshiba, what ever his name is, can beat me. Me? Put Mr. Mori mori into the ring with Bob Sapp and see how far he's going to go with his fancy aikido moves.

Bruce Lee already said once: Kicking someone in the head, is like crouching down to jab someone on the toe. That is: Plain stupid.

-Taison! out

ps. I am a 4 year practitioner of Muay Thai and Ancient Muay Thai (Thai version of Jiu-jitsu developed 2000 years ago), had a lot of cross training with Judo and Hapkido, and I love Jeet Kune Do. :grin: So I do know what I'm talking about. God sakes, It's my proffession! :stuck_out_tongue_winking_eye:

I respect your profession. but the Tae Kwon Do person you "took down" was a student and not the teacher. My teacher in Taw Kwon Do was a 5 time gold metalist at the olympics. I stand by it doesn't matter which form of martial arts you take, it comes down to your skills and know how and when to use them properly. Most people when taking martial arts do the biggest mistake of looking at the person in the face when fighting (Sparring). There a 'V' section on the body you watch. Watching this area can give clues on the fighters next move.And you stated Tae Kwon Do is all Rules??? I disagree. My teacher though taught us rules.. he also taught us how to use our skills in real life situations.So one thing I disagree with you post is that some martial arts are better than others. If you do not use the skills properly, than of course you're going to lose.

In reply to: ducked ALL THE WAY TO THE GROUND, and I came back up AS FAST AS POSSIBLE. He was still pulling his arm back to him, and I hit him twice in the throat. choke choke. I punched him in the windtunnel, and DOWN he went...while he was down there, I kicked him in the face more than twice. After that, I decided that he had enough torture, so I punched him with ALL MY POWER to both temples, and he was out cold.My friend congratulated me with some Pizza, but I was really nervous lol I couldn't eat. My adrenaline pumps and I start shaking after a fight you had a crapload of nice detail in ur post but i just wanted to point out that after sombody gets pounded in their temples, windtunnel, throat, and get kicked in the face more than twice, ur not gonna just shake it off and go buy the guy that beat the shit out of you, pizza.