If you are going to have sex, it shouldnt be for pleasure. Sex is there to have a child.Interesting idea. As long as you apply it to yourself, and don't expect others to follow that philosophy, that's fine.> You are in essence killing people every time you have protected sex.What do you think happens to all the unused sperm and eggs? Are you killing people every time you let pass a few days (if you're a man), or four weeks (if you're a woman) without having sex? Are all the sperm in your testes little babies?> 1- Financial.In the U.S., if you have children and are on government assistance, you are financially penalized if you get married. Perhaps the Church can step in and help the very poor married couples and the dozen or so children they ought to be having. (Poor people having large families tends to lead to more poor people.) > If your BF or GF dumps you with a kid, and you have no way of paying for it what will you do? Ditch the kid into foster care?I suppose you could have had an abortion in the first place. But barring that, most people can survive, with government assistance. Or are you talking about very poor nations?> Little kids wont care but he/she wll be a bastard childThank God you're there to judge, otherwise we'd all be lost.> and will end up taking shit for it in high school.Unless you go to school in the Vatican, I seriously doubt it.> His mother will be called a whore, et cetera.One again, thank God you're there to judge.
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Catholic Belief...
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Note- When you say im judging, you took the things out of context."> Little kids wont care but he/she wll be a bastard childThank God you're there to judge, otherwise we'd all be lost.> and will end up taking shit for it in high school."The little kids thing and the taking shit thing, as well as the whore comment were on frigging idea. I wasnt judging i was just saying that people will. Kids, especially teenagers are jerks. With a marriage, yes you are penalized, but still, if you are dumped its harder for them to get away with it. They have a legal bond.Yes I understand that not having sex you are still wasting the sperm. But by doing so you are killing the sperm senselessly... I think they should die naturally rather than FOR YOUR AMUSEMENT. > If your BF or GF dumps you with a kid, and you have no way of paying for it what will you do? Ditch the kid into foster care?I suppose you could have had an abortion in the first place. But barring that, most people can survive, with government assistance. Or are you talking about very poor nations?What I was talking about is single parents having to work simple low paying jobs to keep watch on their kids. You cant have a babysitter on a small salary and your salary is even smaller if you have to watch your kids half the time. You took a lot of things I said out of context, Im not sure if it was intentional or my crappy writing skills are to blame...
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I don't know where you went to school, but where I went to school, a while ago, I would say that the majority of my classmates lived with one of their divorced parents (joint custody was less common back then), lived with their mom (who never married their father), or lived with both unmarried parents. I don't recall anyone every getting shit for being born out of wedlock, or for living with one parent. Now it's even a lot more common, everywhere, including Western Europe (which is used to be largely Catholic). Where do you go to school?
Given your use of words like "bastard", and your implications of sinning, I think it's fair to say you're judging.
> I think they should die naturally rather than FOR YOUR AMUSEMENT.
Why? Do you know what a sperm cell is? It's a bunch of fluid, proteins, DNA, and organelles, like most of the cells in your body. They're made in massive numbers, and they die in massive numbers (about 300 million per day), and they're all dead within two days, unless one of them fertilizes an egg at some point.
> What I was talking about is single parents having to work simple low paying jobs to keep watch on their kids. You cant have a babysitter on a small salary and your salary is even smaller if you have to watch your kids half the time.
You're painting with a broad brush. There are plenty of married couples with kids, in the same boat, living in various stages of poverty. There are also single parents, whether or not they've ever been married, who have the financial resources to do whatever they want; many have full-time nannies.
> You took a lot of things I said out of context, Im not sure if it was intentional or my crappy writing skills are to blame...
You made some absolute statements that don't depend on context.
In reply to:
o I personally believe birth control is as evil as abortion.
o If you are going to have sex, it shouldnt be for pleasure.
o Sex is there to have a child. That is why it exists.
o You are in essence killing people every time you have protected sex.
o you should be married for multiple reasons....
--1- Financial....
--2- ... he/she wll be a bastard child and will end up taking shit for it in high school. His mother will be called a whore, et cetera. Many other reasons exist too, other than that it is evil.
I think those were reasons other than it's evil. Anyway, those are absolute statements, and stand on their own, don't they?
In my opinion, your attitude toward sex is medieval and unhealthy. Thankfully it's a fringe view, and is uncommon. But to each his own. Few real-word Catholics, at least in North America, Europe, and Australia, subscribe to it.
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In reply to: Sex is there to have a child. That is why it exists I'm going to apply your logic more broadly.-We shouldn't eat things we enjoy, food is there to maintain life and growth.-We shouldn't watch TV/go to the movies/laugh at eachother's jokes as the purpose of sight and hearing is to ensure survival.-We shouldn't try to lose fat because fat is designed to store energy should we need it later.-We shouldn't wear clothes in the summer because the purpose of clothes is to keep us warm, and are therefore unneeded in the summer.You're probably reading these examples and thinking of other reasons why we eat food/see and hear/lose fat/wear clothes. That is exactly my point, nothing has one sole purpose in mind, it simply is what it is. Why/how we do/use things is irrelevant.Sex does not exist simply because we need to reproduce, it just exists. If that is not enough for you I could think of plenty more "reasons" why sex exists:1. To release positive endorphin's to reduce stress2. To increase intimacy and the emotional bond in relationships to make them stronger3. To exercise to keep healthy4. To alleviate the symptoms of "blue balls"5. To feel good! (Not that you'd know, because since you believe ejaculating is killing people, you must never have done it)I currently have sex for pleasure, increased intimacy, better health, stress relieve and when the time comes I will have it to make a child. Even if your argument is true, I'm not hurting anyone. Having sex for pleasure is about as evil as sitting on your bed to watch TV.Now for the marriage part. I am a "bastard" child, my parents were together for 15 years and never married. New Zealand law dictated that since they had been in a de facto relationship for 3 years and had had children then property had to be split equitably when they broke up.I spend time with both my mother and my father and neither is worse off financially because they had a child outside of marriage rather than inside it.I have never once been taunted of mocked because I was born outside of wedlock and my mother was never called a whore.
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wow.... i actually have no idea what to say about this. O.o when i think of sumthing..i will gladly respond.
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Well, Steve & Joe have covered a lot of what I'd have had to say, had I been online when you first posted that astonishing crap! Answer two questions for me please: If whoever made us in the first place didnt intend for sex to be pleasurable why was each women designed with a clitorus, the sole function of which is to deliver pleasure during sex, and is in no way related to reproduction??? "If you are going to have sex, it shouldnt be for pleasure. Sex is there to have a child. That is why it exists"Sex shouldnt be for pleasure? How do you think a man gets the hard on which makes intercourse possible in the first place? Good God grow up..
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I never said it shouldn't be pleasurable, but that shouldn't be the sole purpose.
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Generalization in the concept I was talking about makes no sense. You should go to movies for enjoyment, yes. But does it kill people? No. Wearing clothes is also for decency and protection. And comfort. But still, it doesnt kill anyone. Enjoying murder is psycopathic.
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So why do you believe what you believe? Is there anything in the bible that justifies it? Is it what the Pope says?You still haven't answered these qustions:o Does a couple, where the man, woman, or both are infertile, have the moral right to marry?o If a married couple finds that one of them was unknowingly infertile when they got married, should their marriage be automatically anulled?o If the wife goes through menopause, should the couple be morally obligated to no longer have sexual relations?Does this apply to all forms of sexual conduct? Oral sex? Deep kisssing? What if the husband pops a boner from kissing his infertile wife on the cheek. Should he stop?If you are correct, then the Catholic church is hostile to human happiness, which is medieveal. Why do you believe such things to be correct? (Not all forms of sex will lead to pregnancy. Mary allegedly got pregnant without ever having had sex, so sometimes you just can't win.)
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Enjoying murder is psycopathic.A sperm cell dying is no different than any other cell dying. Every time you move, you probably kill numerous bacteria and yeast cells, not to mention random cells in your body. What gives you the right?How about if I masturbate, catch the semen, and freeze the sperm cells, keeping them alive in suspended animation indefineitely? Wouldn't that be better than letting them die naturally?Finally, are you serious, or are you pulling our leg? The ideas you're describing are way, way on the fringe.
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Well, I'll have to repeat what you said, since you don’t want to take ownership of your own statement: "If you are going to have sex, it shouldn’t be for pleasure"!If two people have intercourse, and it doesn’t occur with sexual pleasure as an integral element of the experience, could you please explain to me what else might prompt this act?! The desire to procreate perhaps??!I have just one question for you; answer it if you can please: Is the desire to procreate going to give a man a hard on, in your experience??
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> Is the desire to procreate going to give a man a hard on, in your experience?
A stiff breeze can give a guy a stiffie. Were this a just world, the winds would be stilled.
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So what are you saying Steve? When I have sex tonight I have to wonder was a stiff breeze responsible for my mans hard on?I think we all know sexual excitement is responsible for the physical signs of arousal, full stop!; lets get that clear for the obviously less well enlightened (sexually backward) visitors to this forum..
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Thinking about a vengeful God gets me all hot and both...Zap!Hey, who turned on the lightning?
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Kohakusango, what kind of perverse God would set up a system where 300 million "potential" babies die each day within every fertile man's scrotum? It would be pretty difficult to get more than a few women pregnant each day, so all those sperm are not even potential babies. You could say that the atoms that make the molecules that make the proteins and DNA that make the sperm cell are also potential babies. Every drop of water is a potential baby.Your abiding interest in the many and varied sexual topics on this Web site lead one to wonder how serious you are.
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What do we know Steve, we're Psychopaths along with the rest of the sperm/egg producing population.Kohakusango, I did see in another forum that you have only just started puberty. I imagine your views on sex will change as you age. Otherwise you've doomed yourself to a life of being a self-confessed murderer.
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Actually it is not required that your soon to be spouse is Catholic, if what I read is true, its just a complete pain in the ass.
See my opinion is the thing about Beliefs is, thats beliefs aka opinions not facts. it is opinion that thou shalt not use birth control. its more of a honor your catholic elders thing.
BirthControl was never mentioned in the bible (Say Onan and you die!) no kidding but seriously I don't think anyone ever read the Onan story. anyway where was I?
Basically the Catholics(and not just the Catholic some christian churchs) see non married sex, masturbation, and birthcontrol as sinful.
Non married sex actually being a sin is debateable because the bible does not mention it, however in those times it seems that most people were married by 14+ anyway so everyone probably did wait till marriage. But anywho I doubt it'd be that sinful if you did it, but I suggest you don't if you want to be a good Catholic.
Such as birthcontrol is not actually mentioned in the bible but is actualy favored intentionally, for they talk about how your suppose to sexually please each other (you and spouse) but it also says basically not to screw yourself, in other words have to many children.
I am to belief they obviously used birth control back then of some sort because I have a hard time believing they only had sex just enough to have 1-3 children. and then stopped.
While I'm not trying to tell you to stray from your beliefs, I am trying to tell you, unless your capable of handling a kid, use birthcontrol.
While I am only 15, I have a 3 and a 6 year old brother who I have to take care of the most because the parents are working etc, so I know how much of a pain in the ass it is to take care of a kid.
so I would defentally suggest birth control until your ready for a kid, because Birht Control being wrong is a belief not a fact.
as for sex with non catholic- you could, since again if I read correctly theres a set thing of rules your soon to be spouse will have to do but they don't actually have to convert to get married, so yeah you could.
but by the looks of what you say you seem to be trying to think of a way you can use birthcontrol without it being wrong, and I don't think you could convince the Catholics its fine to have protected sex because he isn't Catholic.
But like I said, It's a belief not a fact, just because you don't believe that its wrong, wouldn't make you less of a Catholic.