Originally Posted By: bobaliciousBut what do you mean by similar results? I'll assume that you don't mean concentration camps, right? I believe it's ultimately possible. But they certainly wouldn't be called "concentration camps"...something more like "detention camps" probably. That's a long way off, though. I don't think Obama will be in office long enough to make that happen...but I could be wrong. It took Hitler a little less than ten years to make it happen in the way you're referring to. But in general, I refer to a more immediate result...control over the lives of folks in this country in a manner that violates their Constitutional rights.
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An Inconvenient Voice
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I presume that this is the whole gun control issue, right? Because obviously gun control is not new, but its not as if Bush didn't have any involvement. Under Bush's Project Safe Neighbourhood initiative, federal gun crime prosecutions increased by 68 percent. The Justice Department set a new record of charging 23 percent more individuals for violating federal firearms laws. The Bush administration asked for a $95 million increase in spending on gun control programs for 2005.
Why is it that suddenly Obama is the one trying to battle the Second Amendment? Is it simply because he is trying harder? Apart from Obama, Bush hassled more gun owners than any other recent president.
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Originally Posted By: bobaliciousWhy is it that suddenly Obama is the one trying to battle the Second Amendment?It's not "suddenly"...it's ALL HE DID as a senator of Illinois. He pushed anti-gun legislative issues from the time he entered office to the time he left. He leaves Bush in the weeds as far as anti-gun legislation is concerned. And don't forget his involvement with ACORN...a socialist organization that made some nice contributions to Obama's campaign, I might add. He was an active member in ACORN for years...in fact, teaching its principles.
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I didn't mean that he is suddenly doing it all right now, I meant that everyone is suddenly shouting that the president is trying to go against the second amendment but there wasn't much problem when Bush was doing it.Again I ask, is it simply because Obama is trying harder?And apart from removing people's right to bear arms, how else is he destroying the constitution?
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Originally Posted By: bobaliciousI didn't mean that he is suddenly doing it all right now, I meant that everyone is suddenly shouting that the president is trying to go against the second amendment but there wasn't much problem when Bush was doing it.Bush didn't propose the kinds of things Obama did. Read it again...IT'S ALL OBAMA DID IN ILLINOIS!!! Perhaps folks weren't so worried about what he might do in one state, but when he got to the presidency their concerns shot through the roof. I know...people starting buying up all the ammunition in the country as soon as he was ellected. And what was left had double the price-tag.Obama is preparing to take away our freedom of choice on a lot of issues...health care being one of them. He has manipulated the press and put gag orders out on those who disagree with his views; which is a violation of the right to free speach (a Constitutional right). But it's not so much what he has done as it is what he is positioning himself to be able to do. Once he actually does it, it will be too late...which is why a lot of folks are calling "foul" now. He either lied about his birth certificate or lied (about his status as a foreign national) to get college funding. Either way, he's a proven liar. People who don't consider him their "savior" don't trust him.
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I have to go make dinner in a second so I'll address the second half in a while. (You know I'm good for it, I spent a few days on the videos you posted. )Gun Control was not the only thing Obama did in Illinois, but when he was concerned with these issues, he never tried to remove guns completely. The only things he ever tried to do in Illinois with gun control as take away semi-automatics and hand guns from the general public and to keep gun shops a certain distance from schools.He did support retired army and police officers' right to possess concealed weapons.
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Originally Posted By: bobaliciousGun Control was not the only thing Obama did in Illinois... OK...you go and compare the amount of effort spent on gun-control as opposed to anything else. As far as I know, he did not involve himself with any legislation except gun-control related legislation. Not that he ever introduced any...it was all introduced by somebody else. Obama just attempted to piggy-back his anti-gun portion onto it and/or lend support.
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As far as I'm concerned, all politicians, whether they be Dem. or Rep., anti- or liberal, whatever, posses a silver tongue, like Hitler, Obama, and Bush, and several others I'm sure.But I will stand up for the whole gun-control thing in Illinois. Do you know how many kids were killed in CPS? I think they counted up about 50-70 last year, I'll have to check, and from Jan-Mar, about 20 more were killed. KIDS. So, I'll take it for that, i.e. strengthening control laws, like records and things, but as far as completely repealing, no. So I agree, halfway.
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Originally Posted By: thor Originally Posted By: bobaliciousGun Control was not the only thing Obama did in Illinois... OK...you go and compare the amount of effort spent on gun-control as opposed to anything else. As far as I know, he did not involve himself with any legislation except gun-control related legislation. Not that he ever introduced any...it was all introduced by somebody else. Obama just attempted to piggy-back his anti-gun portion onto it and/or lend support. Obama actually sponsored about 65 pieces of legislation while in Illinois that involved expanding tax credits and child-care subsidies for low-income working families, protecting overtime pay for workers, expanding health care for children, and providing job skills training for juveniles.So I'm afraid that you've been had by whatever right-wing publication you got your "facts" from.
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Originally Posted By: thor
Obama is preparing to take away our freedom of choice on a lot of issues...health care being one of them. He has manipulated the press and put gag orders out on those who disagree with his views; which is a violation of the right to free speach (a Constitutional right). But it's not so much what he has done as it is what he is positioning himself to be able to do. Once he actually does it, it will be too late...which is why a lot of folks are calling "foul" now. He either lied about his birth certificate or lied (about his status as a foreign national) to get college funding. Either way, he's a proven liar. People who don't consider him their "savior" don't trust him.
OK, Obama never put gag orders out on anyone. The only gag order that Obama is involved in is one that was put on an ISP 5 years ago under the Bush administration for an FBI investigation. Obama's administration is simply maintaining the gag order, albeit senselessly. But don't worry, the ACLU is on the case!
And whats this business about what he is positioning himself to be able to do? Please give details.
And for the last time, there is no evidence that Obama's birth cert is a fake apart from the collective will of the conservative right. The black man that beat the pensioner and the Peggy Hill wannabe is in fact an American citizen and is eligible to hold the office of President. If you want to make the claim that his birth cert is a forgery, then provide evidence.
So please tell me, how is he a proven liar?
