Obama's healthcare plan
I must agree to what unsupervised said. Im from the UK and the health system works here. Ofcourse its not perfect, but nothing is. Private healthcare is more unhuman and unfair than public healthcare. I think i saw some statistics in the news saying 40 million in america are without healthcare cover. In European countries each and everyone one of those will be covered. For free.
Hawk
Originally Posted By: RadIf the government pays for your favorite company now, why would the approved service providers suddenly change under a plan that would give me access to care, as well as you? LOL! That's not even close to the way it would work. Why not ask the real question...why is it necessary for the Obama administration to attempt to deceive the public?
Originally Posted By: Rad Originally Posted By: thor Originally Posted By: RadIf the government pays for your favorite company now, why would the approved service providers suddenly change under a plan that would give me access to care, as well as you? LOL! That's not even close to the way it would work. Why not ask the real question...why is it necessary for the Obama administration to attempt to deceive the public? I haven't noticed that the Obama administration is trying to deceive.It's the right wing and their lies and scare tactics who are attempting to deceive and doing a fine job of deceiving, too.It's also them that say, "I have what I need already and I don't want any changes". Which is the same as saying, I've got it and I don't give a damn if you do or not. Or it could just be that some folks turn a blind eye to what they don't wish to see. Skipping the OP would do it, too.
Quote: It's the right wing and their lies and scare tactics who are attempting to deceive and doing a fine job of deceiving, too.It's also them that say, "I have what I need already and I don't want any changes". Which is the same as saying, I've got it and I don't give a damn if you do or not. Spot on, Rad.
The funny thing here eddie is that IF what they said was true, everyone would be against it.
its ll bullshit, outrageous bullshit at that. Anyone can go and read the proposal, you can see that what they claim is absolute shit. Why are americans so fucking dumb and lazy? why do they jsut take someones word for it instead of going and finding out themselves?
Thats the real problem here, maybe before we can reform health care we first have to reform education so that todays kids can pull the head from the ass, do some research and be able to both read and understand a proposal, before we can have any fucking health care that is actual reform and makes sense.
Now Thor, feel free to jump in and spout bullshit about how we are stupid and can not read and we need to believe what the right wing tells us You will be ignored as always, but go ahead and spout your drivel.
like turning a blind eye to success in other countries?the underlying theme of the rich, right wing objection is "let the poor suffer"Now, you'd better go carve an ironic "NOT!" after the inscription on your statue of liberty
I agree with you Chance, it's mind boggling. The proposal is out there for everyone to read, yet people refuse to read it and instead want to listen to the Scare Tactics force feed to them by the media and the political parties. People need to be more proactive, they'll find it will taken them further in life than being a lemming.
Because then money is spread thinner, and they can't afford to cover the $9,000 worth of repairs that insurance wouldn't pay, that they could before, and instead, send you somewhere like Jim's Discount Repairs!, they end up doing worse a job, and you have to go in more often.What I was saying, is that it should be more like insurance should pay for 60% or something. That's what should be put into play, instead of the other, becuase then, you don't have to go somewhere where you're told to go. An HMO, is it? That does that? That's what I think the public health will be like. "We don't care if they screw up your surgery, at least you're getting it." kind of attitude, is how I foresee it happening, after the original zeal is done and over with.
Originally Posted By: LuvMyCatsThat's what I think the public health will be like. "We don't care if they screw up your surgery, at least you're getting it." kind of attitude, is how I foresee it happening, after the original zeal is done and over with. And all the options Obama is saying you will have will be gone within ten years, leaving you no option at all but to go get your ahem "surgery".
Wait, so is public health care supposed to improve EVERYONES insurance or just the poor/uninsured?
Just to make sure, you DO realize that I'm agreeing in saying that uni. health is bad, right??Amped: What [the idea] is, is that the government pays for ALL health expenses, like insurance, kind of, does. It'll basically be a tax-payer supported "insurance" that pays for 100%, or most of, nearly everything.
Originally Posted By: LuvMyCats That's what I think the public health will be like. "We don't care if they screw up your surgery, at least you're getting it." kind of attitude, is how I foresee it happening, after the original zeal is done and over with. but, it's simply not like that at all in countries with public heath.Please, look at all the countries that have adopted a public system and then see how many have reverted back to private.
In all countries...so-na...I see...
Nonetheless, I will check up on some things, but I still reserve the right to my opinion.
Originally Posted By: unsupervisedPlease, look at all the countries that have adopted a public system and then see how many have reverted back to private. I honestly wonder if any of them ever even had the option to do so. Once government has control, they usually don't give it away.
not entirely. There have been numerous crown corporations that have been privatized over the years here with varying degrees of success.It's not easy to find the right balance in that regard. There are some things best left in the hands of private business professionals because they are way more efficient at turning a profit that the government is. On the other hand, there are industries, like healthcare, where the end service to patients is of greater importance than the bottom line. Does that mean that rampant waste with no regard to accountability is acceptable? Of course not. Lack of accountability is my greatest complaint with all aspects of the public sector (as I said, it's imperfect). But, in some cases such as accessible public healthcare for every man, woman and child, the ends do justify the means.Life wins over profit.You can call me a liberal, I don't mind. Such things are relative anyway. Like the majority of Canadians, I'm a centrist. We've embraced socialized healthcare yet never elected a socialist government. We move back and forth between Liberal and Conservative governments but never stray as far left as NDP or as far right as the former Reform party. (our current political climate is a little goofy so I won't bore you further with that story lol)You have freedom of choice when it comes to politics. You don't need to tow the party line. Most political systems have their good and bad concepts. There is no rule saying that you can't pick and choose the parts to assemble the best society you can achieve. Public heath does not a socialist nation make.
Originally Posted By: unsupervisedLife wins over profit.How I wish it were true. Unfortunately, in this day and age, you can't count on it being true...in either government or the private sector. Either way, you stand a chance of losing. And it is this very fact that always ultimately causes Socialism/Communism to fail. Quote:Public heath does not a socialist nation make. All by itself, probably not. But add in a push for gun control, gag orders and staged question/answer sessions where the news reporters are all given their questions to ask by the administration and you have the makings of a socialist regime the likes of which this country has never even been close to.
Quote:staged question/answer sessions where the news reporters are all given their questions to ask by the administration as a strange coincidence, our current government, the most conservative we've ever seen, is notorious for this tactic.
Originally Posted By: unsupervised Quote:staged question/answer sessions where the news reporters are all given their questions to ask by the administration as a strange coincidence, our current government, the most conservative we've ever seen, is notorious for this tactic. It's new for us...maybe Canada is more socialist than you think.
HELL NO!now, if you'll excuse me, my 17 room mates are holding my spot in the bread line
new?Really?Bush did it for 8 years before now, Reagan did it, and Nancy ran the country because he could not recall his own shoe size, Nixon did it up right, and was at the center of watergate.Or since they were all rethuglicans, did they go unnoticed and now you care as its a democrat?If you think its new, maybe your less intelligent than I gave you credit for, granted, it was not a great deal to begin with.
