An adults view upon circumcsion

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This orginal post was posted on govteen by someone who contacted me with regards to my own adolecent circumcision. He told the story of his own personal life and how circumcision has affected him. The moderation on govteen deleted it, because they said that adults were unwelcome to post at all, even informative information.-------------Hello. First off, let me introduce myself. My name is Daniel, and I am a senior networking administrator for Quest Communications. I live in the greater Seattle Washington area. I am 31 years old, married with 2 boys, Samuel and Daniel. My wife is a registered nurse that is a doctor.s aid in a pediatrician.s clinic here in the Seattle area also. I found Govteen thru a link to a specific person.s situation here. .Roo. Who had an operation similar to my own at a similar age. After reading a significant amount of his posts, and other posts on the topic I felt that it would be of benefit to give my story.When I was 14 my father died. He died of lung cancer from smoking tons and tons of cigarettes. When I was 16 my mother remarried to a gentleman who me and my younger brother who was 11 at the time, just totally adored. He fit into the family very well and life moved on. I decided that I wanted to be circumcised because I did not like feeling out of place in the high school locker room, It was completely my choice and I went to my parents over it. We saw my doctor and he told us about how wonderful it was to be circumcised. How it should have been done at birth. My parents were so convinced that they also schedule my little brother to be circumcised also. Once we explained everything to my little brother we were both excited and ready for the surgery.A few weeks latter we was scheduled to have our operations the same day, my little brothers was to be done after mine, by the same doctor. We were going to have the standard operation. Low, medium tight, fernulum removed. When the day came for the surgery we was prepped for surgery, and put in the same waiting room. I was wheeled out and taken to the operating room. I am allergic to inhaleable anesthesia, so I was given Tylenol at first, and then local injections. I sat up and watched the entire procedure with fascination. I was slightly horrified with the removal of the fernulum. My penis was stitched up, and then bandaged up, and I was sent back to my waiting room while my brother had his operation. He was put to sleep and does not remember any of it.Everything seemed fine for the first few days, and then my brother came to me and asked me if I was having any problems with my penis. I said no, and asked him if he was. He showed me his penis and his entire penis was swollen from the past of his pubic bone, to the end of his penis, including his scrotum. I immediately told mom and dad, and he was rushed to the hospital emergency room. He was placed on very strong antibiotics and after a few days the swelling went down. Unfortunately his swelling had ruptured the suture wounds, He would either have to live with a very unsightly circumcision scarred penis, or have a second surgery to fix it. He opted for the second procedure.A few months latter he asked if we could compare our penises, and we did as we had been thru this basically together. His circumcision was VERY tight while he was erect. It was so tight that it pulled his scrotum upwards. Mine however wasn.t so tight, but on my 5.5 inch erect penis, I had a circumcision scar of approximately � inch wide.I had been sexually active with a girlfriend at the time of my circumcision, and it was nearly 4 months before I could have sex with her again without feeling the pain in my penis. I have never in my life experienced sex quite the way I did for my first few times with her. Sex with a circumcised penis is significantly underneath that of an intact penis. I can still enjoy sex, I can still orgasm and I have full complete functionality of my penis. But significant pleasure has been lost, and unfortunately even with reconstruction it cannot be regained.My brother still to this day, 17 years latter still has painful erections and does not even like to get erections, let alone have sexual intercourse with his wife. He has no children. He has been divorced once because of inadequacies in bed. He is happily married at this current date, but does not regularly have sex with his wife.This leads me to my children. In 1992 Samuel was born, when he was born he was put into the nursery. 3 days after his birth I went to look at him, as I had went to his crib once or twice an hour most everyday. When Samuel was not there, I asked where he was and they said that he had been taken for the routine circumcision. When I heard this I grabbed the nurse by her jacket and screamed in her face. (I still recall the words today) If my son is circumcised I will do everything in my power to put this hospital out of business, the circumcision needs to be stopped this very instant. I demand to be taken to my son this second. She hit the panic button on the wall, and called security. At the same time called down to the operating room. They had just injected Samuel with the penile nerve block agent, and was preparing to rip his foreskin from his glans. We caught them in time. The only harm that was done to Sam was the injection into his penis. I was charged by the local police with misdemeanor assault, but it was later dropped. Come to find out that whenever we signed the paperwork for the billing, one of the forms gave consent for circumcision, it was not clearly defined and it was practically in the fine print. When I contested this, and asked what the big deal was I was told that it was such a routine procedure that they only did that as a legal safety precaution. Latter one of the nurses came to me and told me why it was as such, and she told me that it was listed like that so that they could circumcise as many boys as possible. The hospital received over $5,000 for each infant foreskin that they procured from a skin reconstruction company, nearly half of the cost of the entire pregnancy. A few days latter, a doctor approached me and told me that since I signed the forms, I gave up the legal right to not have my son circumcised. And that on his next checkup, that he would be legally circumcised. We never went back to that hospital, or saw that doctor ever again.In 1994 Dan was born. We read over the documentation very clearly, and when we came to a .circumcision release form. we refused to sign it. The nurse said if you refuse to sign it, the cost for the entire plan for the pregnancy goes up by $10,000. Your insurance will cover the circumcision, so we suggest that you sign the forms. We asked for the paperwork that we had already signed, and ripped them up and went to another hospital. We made it very clear that we wanted our child to not be circumcised. This hospital charged a waiver fee of $500 for any child not circumcised. We eagerly paid this, and believe it or not, our insurance company covered it.Both of our children to this day are intact. Sam is 13, going on 14 this summer and has just entered puberty. He has never had an issue with his foreskin. He has never had any tightness, any soreness, or any hygienic problems. We taught him at an early age how to retract his foreskin and clean it while he bathed.Dan is 11, going on 12 a week before Christmas. He has had some minor problems with his foreskin. He has been unable to retract his foreskin completely as of yet. Our family doctor inspects this with each physical he gets. He has 2 adhesions from his foreskin to his glans. The doctor said that if these do not go away by the time he starts to enter puberty that they can be surgically fixed, without any circumcision.When I read over some of the threads here at Govteen I asked Sam and Dan if anyone had ever teased them about there foreskins. They said that .no, they have never been teased..The bottom line for circumcision in my life has been.A) I wanted it done to me, this was one of the largest mistakes of my entire life.B) It has significantly reduced my sexual pleasure.C) My brother was one of those who had a very healthy penis, and is now significantly scarred for the rest of his life, both physically and mentally from a procedure that did not need done.D) My children were nearly butchered without my knowing consent, for the profit of a hospital.Overall I agree with many of the posters on this website. Circumcision is a crime. I am a victim in my own stupidity. My children will not be victims. And I hope that thru education the victims in the United States of this crime will slowly cease to have to endure this social aberration.That said, the practice that my wife works refuses to do any circumcisions unless they are necessary for the health of the individual. They have never done an infant circumcision in 10 years. They have done a total of 7 circumcisions on adolescents and adults in 10 years. Every single one was done extremely lose and only to alleviate true phimosis after other treatments had failed.

That's certainly a good case against circumcision.Roo, have you experienced a decrease in sensation, as Daniel described? Or are you still healing, so it's too early to tell?In reply to:A few days latter, a doctor approached me and told me that since I signed the forms, I gave up the legal right to not have my son circumcised. And that on his next checkup, that he would be legally circumcised.That's the craziest think I ever heard. I don't think there's any way they can stop you from not getting a medical procedure done, short of a medical emergency. Even then, a court order might be required. You can't just sign away certain rights.

Masturbation is difficult at best, but its still possible.. And yes, sensation has dramatically left my penis.FYI.I have been now banned from govteen for aruging this posts removal.

They seem to be a lot more liberal (or is that libertarian?) around here.Before you arrived, we discussed the issue of sensation, circumcised versus not, but none of us really knew what we were talking about. Surgical complications also. Once again, thanks for sharing your experiences.

that story makes me even happier to live in the UK.Circumsision is not 'the norm' over here, I have never been with a guy who is cut, never even seen a guy whos been cut (in the flesh that is) And my boys, thankfully are still intact.

Wow.. What scares me the most is the part (if true) about the hospital basically requiring the circumcision. It a shady organization to say the least. Something like that should be reported or made public. Many people don't have the will to back down from being strongarmed like that.

Im sure if you asked the hospital they would give a rather different story, we all know that.

When I was cut, they asked me if I wanted to donate my own foreskin to help burn victims.. I wonder how much my doctor would have sold my skin for.. I insited that it be disposed of, but sometimes I wonder if it actually was.

As I said above, I don't see how that can possibly be legal. Any litigators around here?

Yeah I can't see it as being legal either. If you don't sign, they push the price up to $10,000. Of course, we don't know what teh starting price was, but still.

I'm having a hard time believing this too. I just know from my personal experiences that I was physically asked if I wanted it done or not. And then had to sign a consent form giving them permission to do the procedure. I have two sons and they were born at two different hospitals. Both times I was asked first.

too bad you did it tho However the is significnat information about foreskin farming from infant foreskins... And hospitals are paid significantly for them.

Yeah, I was asked also. I think I signed a form where I denied the preocedure. I don't remember, but there was no pressure or change in price etc...

Signing a consent form doesn't mean that anyone has a right to force a procedure on you or your baby (this is regarding the doctor's saying that, once the form is signed, you can't stop them from doing the circumcision, as opposed to the price change issue).

I think parents need to be more informed on this issue. I honestly never knew the benefits/disadvantages before I came to this site. And seriously I had only ever seen one guy who was uncircumsized in my own sexual experiences. Not that it was a bad thing. It really doesn't matter to me. I think I just had it done because it is an 'in the norm' thing to do. And when I asked my doctor what the difference was, he said basically it's easier to take care of and most people have it done. Which from coming to this site, I've learned is not the case. So, thanks for the enlightenment guys! If I ever have another one, I'll definately think long and hard.

In reply to:he said basically it's easier to take care of and most people have it doneWhich confirms the idea that doctors don't know everything. People need to be informed before dealing with doctors and hospitals.Doctors can't keep up with all the literature in every field, so sometimes they have stale ideas. They're also a product of their own culture.

Well it is easier if circumcised. It doesn't take significant effort to clean under the forskin, but it is easier and there are much less chances of infections etc... but I don't think it's worth it overall.

I don't think I'd go for it if I had a son, but your assessment is fair and balanced.

Sdp, I hate to aruge... But circumcision doesnt necessarily reduce the possibilty for infections. It reduces some specfic infections, sometimes. It also increases the chances for other infections all of the time. Every single medical article that says circumcision reduces the chance for aids, std's and UTI's have been proven wrong by several other articles.. There was information to such on govteen but I dont feel like going back there atm to pull the info.

I don't know about circumcision "increasing" the chances for certain infections, but I have lived life much longer than you and from personal experience, know for a fact, that there are issues associated with having a forskin that I wouldn't have if I were circumcised. Given that, I still don't advocate circumcision.

I don't think the doctor wasn't informed or "doesn't know everything". I think he probably felt it was easier to explain or easier for me to understand rather than get into all the 'scientific' reasons.