why you or I when the issue is coys? Why not send me a private message to discuss my position if you thought it inapropriate?Why post it and rupture the flow of expression. You are indeed an angry loose cannon.There are many reasons why you are convinced im wrong. I think some of them are. Firstly, you have it in your head im some piss ant shrink armed with a text book of bull shit and wouldnt have a clue how to help others because im to interested in looking clever or to out of touch with real life ive only got a book of fucking theories to consult. The contradiction is damien my motivation to say anything is 10 years of coping with servere depression after the most appaling of circumstances. 10 years of grief, loss confusion isolation and dispair.The thing i want coys to most live upto if anything is to star it all in the face, meet that situation by looking wide eyed right back at it accepting whatever emotion it engenders. Yes ive read the fucking textbook and the contradiction is in some circumstances your self knowledge is the last thing to use to assist somebody else.It serves only to further isolate a person if you cant equal, challenge and meet their emotional situation. It comes across like where do people get the outlook to be all nice and concerned when im full of hell. How do i get to their disposition and how much more aware of my own loneliness and isolation because of my suffering.So fuck psychaitry, ive put in the time and have bought the right to decide when and when it does not serve, ultimatley im resposible for my expression in thought and deed.Perhaps you should try trusting someone who you percieve to be more intelligent and experienced than you, and i would be the last person you have in mind, and on that issue perhaps you would be right, however i can sense enough of your position to know your breathing your own stale air.Do you have depression? is your anger a symtom? are you angry you have touched upon some sense of intuaitve truth that sees you brualised, isolated and marginalised in the modern world.?it is clear you have a clear sense of what you think your about, thats worth having.
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Rock Bottom
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Coys it is great you are able to talk to your friends dad about him, and share your memories with his friends. I am sorry you find yourself in these cirsumstances. I am sorry that damien and I seem to have locked horns which was not my intention, however it is no contest and if you find truth that speaks to you in anything he or I say then use it. Remember you are very special, you are a sentient being with the potential to love, care and enrich yours and others experiences. Fear not, even in such times of anxiety fear not, Take care.
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Coys, that is stellar!That had to be a very healing experience for you, your friends, and a hurting father.I would say to you that you and your friends have a wonderful opportunity to be a real support for a hurting man who needs you. And the result will be that you will find healing in doing that.You have good instincts that will help you through this difficult time.
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In reply to: Why not send me a private message to discuss my position if you thought it inapropriate? The reason I didn't pm you was because I felt the op and others needed to hear what I was saying. I felt you were saying things in a public forum that were counterproductve. As such, the refutation needed to be in the same public forum. In reply to: You are indeed an angry loose cannon. Why do you think that? I am definitely not an angry person. Your post kind of pissed me off, but how does that make me an angry person? You have no right to make that judgment about me.I actually didn't think you were a shrink at all. I did feel like you had a bit of textbook knowledge and was using it rather carelessly and cavalierly. I apologize if my judgment was wrong. In reply to: So fuck psychaitry I agree In reply to: Do you have depression? is your anger a symtom? The fact is that I have experienced depression...major depression...the kind that keeps me up all night and laying on the sofa all day staring at a blank wall feeling like the I'm no longer stuck in a black hole but have somehow become the black hole. So I'm not just speaking as a therapist, I'm speaking as a therapist with personal experience. As for the anger...once again you are making a huge, unfounded judgment. Depression has been described as anger turned inwards. I do experience anger as anyone does, and I express it when appropriate...in appropriate ways. In reply to: i can sense enough of your position to know your breathing your own stale air. Please explain. In a pm if you wish.All that being said...I loved this last post of yours (aside from the warrantless pot shots at me and my character). It seemed to me to be genuine and heartfelt, something that could not be said about your first post. Even your language in this post is genuine, as opposed to what I felt was a pretentious attempt at elucidation in your earlier posts. That was my problem. You had an opportunity to share from your experience and encourage someone. Instead you brought us psychobabble. But that was then. This is now. You obviously have much to say on this that the op could benifit from. I appreciate that you have decided to shift gears and share from your heart and your experience. I think you can be of great benifit to this poster and others...Hell you already have.My horns aren't locked. Shoot, I don't even think I have horns. But I do have two hands, one of which is extended to you. How bout we shake hands and "partner up" with others here to be part of a helpful community?
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It was a very nice night,we talked about our friend from 7pm till 230 pm,were going to talk about him tonite,it was just so nice.it really made us all feel great.
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That is great! It is wonderful that all of you are finding so much support in each other!
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I am not a shrink. I did embark on that type of training but returned to creative arts via a detour through humanistic psycology.I EMBRACE YOUR EXTENDED HAND.Much of what i know in healing will not fall into a rational body of knowledge and i am for ever frustrated at not being able to mediate to others my ability to help them.I agree that meaning itself is found in words (the current semiotic paradigm) though i also agree with bartok, words cannot express anything with intrinsic humane value.Words are not useless but not useful when you wish to extend your humaninty to another person, this is prinipally my sadness at the period of late capitalism and the post modern.My real frustration is finding a site with many kids all so lost, alone and estranged from the people in their real communtiy. It is insanity, absolute madness.On the note of coys that why i was trying to engender emotional suffering or anger in him, to ground his reality away from looking to parents who have brutalised his emotions for direction. I see him at the cross roads of painful realisations, and at a crucial time when he can affirm his own will and severe connections to the conditioning that appears to only drag him into self doubt, depression and lack of confidence, at the risk of beind wrong i feel he needs to learn to fight, as well as bleed.I
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Noone cares how smart you are. If you want to help people, use language everyone can understand. I'm sure Damien could bust out the shrink-speech if he wanted to, but he is more concerned about helping people, not trying to show the world he's received tertiary education...
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In reply to:
I agree that meaning itself is found in words
I don't agree with that.
I think it's postmodernistic pablum. -
Well joe that message you replied to was in part a specific responce to Damien, in general though you should really read all my postings to make a judgement. I am guilty of some pysco babble but you will find a wealth of common sense responces if you would care to look at existing posts with the grace of new eyes, but i forget selecting the negative is a big part of depression as is anger. Take care.
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What is your opinion (if any) on the spiritual perspective of depression, this has been my secret area of research for 10 years, secret because although research it was motivated by my experiences and it was a personal search for understanding. Have you read any Rumi? Or Macus Aurelieus or Zen philosophy. I can take things from most spiritual traditions but dont identify with any specifically.also what do you think about masochism and the choice to remain angry as depression?
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In reply to:
but i forget selecting the negative is a big part of depression as is anger.
You seem to have an obsession with portraying others as angry and depressed. Where does that come from? How does that serve you?
As for your questions about Rumi, Zen, and masochism, it would be in very poor form to hijack this thread with a discussion that frankly no one outside of yourself is interested in. Not to be disrespectful of you...just trying to be respectful of the forum and the op.
(Besides, I don't really have any strong opinions or thoughts about any of it at the moment. :smirk:) -
This is fucking insane,I dont understand all these big words and everything,I just wanted sum help on how to deal with this.My life feels like its on pause,I dont eat,sleep or watch tv anymore,Im not the same me and I feel like I never will be.
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Coys, I'm sorry your thread got hijacked.Some of us were trying to help you. Others...not so much.
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opps just realised what a thread is, and i have indeed hijacked coys's. Many apolagies to coys. Will reply to you Damien on your community post.
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Coys in all honesty no one here can actualy help you. We can listen, respond and perhaps share experiences, however if you are hoping to find a progressive systematic route to managing your depression and illiminating it in the long term then i do strongly think you need to look inside you and communicate with those in your environment. I would not say these postings arn't benificial but they are no cure for depression. I could talk to im blue in the face about my experiences on an internet forum and not feel a jot better for it. Believe me there is nothing worse than a forum of depressives helping each other because the illness causes inconsistency, mood swings, poor judgement and a host of things that influence the postings. It is akin to the blind leading the blind. So much so when i trained as a counselor we got a whole module on being able to know when you yourself are depressed and then refraim form work so as not to be an inappropriate influence to other people feeling Vulnerable. Easy for me to say i know but coys i would encourage you to be around people in your environment who are not depressed and try your best to engague in any activity even if you have no appitite for it. I challenge you to construct a posotive experiences for yourself, anything you like, i chalenge you to see the good in something or detect a faint enthusiasm for any type of activity that involves you leaving the house and thinking positivly for however short a period of time.
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Once again I find myself saying amen to a lot of what you're saying. (see...I knew we'd get there).
However, I disagree with this. And I'm only stating my disagreement because I think even it might give coys some more hope. Here it is:In reply to:
Believe me there is nothing worse than a forum of depressives helping each other because the illness causes inconsistency, mood swings, poor judgement and a host of things that influence the postings. It is akin to the blind leading the blind.
I disagree for two reasons. First of all, I don't believe there is a such thing as 'depressives'. There are only people with depression. Depression isn't an identity, it's an illness.
Secondly, although I do agree that someone in the throes of a major depressive episode would not be the best person to counsel someone who is experiencing depression, I believe several of us here (possibly even you sanctuary) are coming from a place of experience. I am not experiencing depression now, but I have in the past. So I can speak not only from knowledge, but experience as well. Apparently you can say the same for yourself. Don't cut yourself short.For coys - What does this mean for you? It means that what you are experiencing now is part of a process. All of it...the depression...the loss...the hurt...It sucks right now, more than we can possibly understand. But it is part of the process of where you are going and part of the person you are becoming. You will one day be something you couldn't possibly ever have imagined. It will be glorious. And when you do, it won't be in spite of the kinds of challenges you are facing now, it will be because of them. And you will be the one offering hope to others from your experience.
Hang in there. Keep posting. And like sanctuary said, you must stay connected to people around you. That is vital. -
coys, do you still have your friends, and your friends family to talk to? Or has the whole thing kind of fizzled out?It happens like that sometimes, once the shock of death wears off, some people need to greive alone. You do not sound like one. Reach out to those around you, get a hug, and I would even let your friends know how you feel. Give 'em a call and REQUEST that they come get you and basically drag you out to do something.Your amongst the living for a reason. Get back to living, and in time you will enjoy it again.
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I still have my friends to talk to but not face to face really,they are busy with school but I get to talk to them on the internet.
Im just having a hard time wanting to leave the house or get out of bed.im so unmotivated. -
At the moment your emotionally drained. It isn't that unusual. Is there ANYONE that might be able to motivate you to get up and go...Someone you could make plans with. You might do more if you feel an obligation to doing something with or for someone besides you.What about the idea of volunteering at the local animal shelter at least 1 day a week, or every day for an hour or something like that? It is something you love, and feeling like you are helping those critters out, might get you moving a little more.