Fetal stem cell reasearch veto

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I may not be a polliticain per se, but I do strive to inspire.

And you inspire me to strive.

awww... huggles

It's OK -- we were slapping each other hard on the back while we hugged, followed by shoulder punches.

So long as you two dont suck each other off in the street for public view I dont care what ya do, back smacking or not.More importantly, to get this thread someplace back near where it started let me ask this:alot of people are against fetal stem cell research, if thta research could lead to a cure that affects someone in your family or a close friend does that change your mind ?does watching them suffer and endless children with cancer and lukemia suffer make ya thin that maybe those stem cells that are just being trashed anyways could be used to do the research to put an end to diabeties, breast cancer,alzhiemers,lou gerrings desease, or maybe even sickle cell anemia ?Maybe it wont, but current theorys are that it will. isnt it worth that chance to take something that is nothign more thena ball fo cells and rather then trash it, use to to attempt to find a cure for shit that plagues millions of people world wide ?

if thta research could lead to a cure that affects someone in your family or a close friend does that change your mind ?Ironically (not), a lot of the conservatives who are for research (and who you'd think would not be) happen to have family members with illnesses that might benefit from the results of stem cell research. Maybe if Bush's daughters had something like type 1 diabetes, he'd be singing a different tune. It's all part of the Carman "I've got mine, screw you all" philosophy.The folks who are against the research are the same folks who are hostile toward science in general.

well, the simple plan would be to jam all those frozen embrios into surrogate mums then have all the folk with alzheimer's, ALS, etc to adopt the sudden glut of babies.That's what god would want

sorta like the couples who cant have kids who pray and pray and then take fertillity drugs and pop out a litter of 6 or 7 lil pups ?the best part is them then saying "Its a blessing, its what god wanted !"No asshole, god decided your unfit to be a parent, thats why you never had fucking kids before and you used science to get a whole damned litter when god said you cant have any...I know Im nota believer in god, but damnit, I love using that line...

"...let me ask this:alot of people are against fetal stem cell research, if thta research could lead to a cure that affects someone in your family or a close friend does that change your mind ?"Your talking about fundamentalist and for most of them the answer would be no its not going to change their mind. I see this first hand all the time around here. I work with a women who's kid has repeatedly gotten cancer (I'm pretty sure it was leukemia), yet when this topic was brought up she still believes stem cell research is wrong. She claims it would be a sin for her son to live by the murder of another. I have an uncle who recently passed away, at 61, from complications of diabetes. His daughter is in her twenties and has horrid hypoglycemia. Regardless of those facts my aunt is still opposed to any kind of stem cell research on moral grounds (personally, I find that rather sick.) I could go on and on sighting people of the same ilk but I digress.What you have to remember about these people is that, in their view of the world, logic and reason have no weight when faced with the will of god. The will of god seems to be their answer for everything and their admonishment of responsibility for anything. Life is much easier when nothing is required of you other than to have faith. Should their child die of a disease, that stem cell research could have saved, they need feel no guilt, for it was the will of god that their child should die. After all, that child is going to be in better place anyway, living in a mansion on a cloud where the streets are paved with gold.Fundamentalist seem to have such a low regard for the teachings they espouse to follow and such a high regard for their own beliefs, but that's an argument for a different thread. Where fundamentalist patriarchal rule is imposed societal progression stops, or at best slows to crawl. It is my contention that such fundamentalist notions should be, at most, little more than a counter point to popular culture but should never be allowed to drive society. The reasons behind fundamentalist beliefs and actions, whether they themselves are aware of it or not, far to often, tend to be rather duplicitous, and further as demonstrated throughout history and the world over, ultimately detrimental to the betterment and longevity of society and, I believe, arguably the whole of mankind.

How positively little you understand, OldFolks, anything about what you are talking about with regards to folks who believe in God. It is the nature of human beings to mock what they don't understand...you prove this out here and now.You remind me of the folks who went around killing people because they were "witches" (the Salem Witch trials, etc).From an old Rush tune:Quick to judge, quick to anger...slow to understandIgnorance and prejudice...and fear walk hand in hand

"... about with regards to folks who believe in God."I do not deride belief in god and if you reread I made no mention of it or of Christianity or any other religion for that matter. What I take issue with are fundamentalist of any faith that hijack society, science and progression to serve their own ends, be they philosophical or political.It is my assertion that a Christan does not equate to fundamentalist Republican but the latter would like you to believe that to further their own agenda.

I agree!

"You remind me of the folks who went around killing people because they were "witches" (the Salem Witch trials, etc)."No, (but an excellent example) those people where the fundamentalist that I take issue with. A people so blinded by faith and their interpretation of sacred texts that reason had no merit.

"Fundamentalist" does not mean "blind"...though I do believe you have been blinded into believe so. They were blind back in Salem those days...fundamentalist or not...and now you are blind as well. Why don't you try asking what it means insteading of pre-judging what it means?

the absolute problem with fundimentalism is the "we are right" attitude. While more moderate people of every religion are open to self doubt, reflection and reason.

-we can burn all those we beleive to be witches becasue WE ARE RIGHT
-we can crash planes into the world trade centre because WE ARE RIGHT
-we can ignore facts, political will of the public and the opinions of more moderate scholors who profess to follow the same religion as us becasue WE ARE RIGHT

say it with me...

We
Are
Right

maybe it can be shortened to some sort of acronym for convienience.

LOL...you don't get it either, Mr. U...but I can deal better with a humorous approach to it. Let's just say there's more than one definition to the word and start from there.

Well, we can start with dictionary deffinitions if you like...

1- A usually religious movement or point of view characterized by a return to fundamental principles, by rigid adherence to those principles, and often by intolerance of other views and opposition to secularism.

2- A. often Fundamentalism An organized, militant Evangelical movement originating in the United States in the late 19th and early 20th century in opposition to Protestant Liberalism and secularism, insisting on the inerrancy of Scripture.
B. Adherence to the theology of this movement.

So, instaed of saying I don't get it, how about you share your definition of fundamentalism? Explain where you see tollerence, understanding and acceptance within fundamentalism.
Or you could just say "we are right"

What is your definition of "fundamentalist"?So far in this thread you've told people that they're wrong, they're closed-minded, and they don't understand. Everywhere in the world, in all of history (maybe with the exception of Moorish Spain, which was Islamic), theocracies have been a disaster for their citizens, and the mortal enemy of democracy. Afghanistan under the Taliban was a case in point. New England in the 1600's was not a bastion of free thinking -- or democracy. Europe in the Dark Ages was no Club Med.Can you actually address the arguments, or is "you closed-minded people just don't get is" all you got?" Can you tell us where theocracy has worked well? (Keep in mind that if you have the Ten Commandments, you probably won't have much use for the Bill of Rights. What will be done with the heretics?) What does freedom of though and freedom of inquiry mean if the governing authorities think they already have the absolute answers to all of the important questions?And why does fundamentalist religious thought line up so well with authoritarian political thought? I have my own ideas, but I wonder what you think about it.

Iv been chatting with Java the last little bit while the whole convo is far to long i was ordered to post the following as she refuses to do so...Isoprophyl says:oh for the love of god i just read that idiotic thread on a2aIsoprophyl says:im just in awe how it led to discussing jews in the music industryIsoprophyl says:and, the stem cell research wont go to ireland it will go to swtizerland or sweden...If I fuck a werewolf and knock her up, will she have a baby or a litter of pups? says:ahh yes good ole or should i say little purpleIsoprophyl says:where it already is, because believe it or not america bites as far as scientific advancmentIsoprophyl says:We could be so much further if we didnt have an idiot for a president. Isoprophyl says: I took the time to make you people the link java sent me here and that was in 2002If I fuck a werewolf and knock her up, will she have a baby or a litter of pups? says:you shall never hear an argument from me about losing that piece of shit presIsoprophyl says:that day i come back to america is the day we get someone intelegant as the leader of itIf I fuck a werewolf and knock her up, will she have a baby or a litter of pups? says:so your gone forever eh?Isoprophyl says:hahah maybeIsoprophyl says:but yea, america has never even been neck and neck with the top countries as far as stem cell research goes.If I fuck a werewolf and knock her up, will she have a baby or a litter of pups? says:intelligent people dont run for office, they get idiots to run and stay behind the curtain pulling the stringsIsoprophyl says:israel, which has a much higher religious affilation (obviously) is SO much further alongIf I fuck a werewolf and knock her up, will she have a baby or a litter of pups? says:thats because america has a president that talks like a man with a paper assholeIsoprophyl says:Bush can be amused by a peice of string. Hell, he probably didnt even read the bill and the part about most of the cells being THROWN AWAYIsoprophyl says:hahaIf I fuck a werewolf and knock her up, will she have a baby or a litter of pups? says:saying bush read that is assuming the bastard can readIsoprophyl says:which was very apparent he cant when the towers were hit and he continued to try to read a childrens book for the next 7 minutes...god i hate that manIf I fuck a werewolf and knock her up, will she have a baby or a litter of pups? says:you know he didnt, he knew it was about stem cell research and vetoed it with out ever looking at itIf I fuck a werewolf and knock her up, will she have a baby or a litter of pups? says:The only good thing he did was to inspire half retarded children because they now know that ANYONE can become president of the USIsoprophyl says:seriously...Isoprophyl says:You know, i think it was nostradamous that said 'If I fuck a werewolf and knock her up, will she have a baby or a litter of pups? says:a moron with a history of drug abuse made it, anyone canIsoprophyl says:in the new millenium the village idiot will rule'Isoprophyl says:from what i can tell, he was drunk until he was fourty and which time his dads friends gave him money to find oil, which he couldnt.Isoprophyl says:but yea, if you're in that thread again mention that all of the research is being done in sweden, israel and singapore...Isoprophyl says:america wasnt ever even part of that pictureIsoprophyl says:afk a bit, going out for coffee.If I fuck a werewolf and knock her up, will she have a baby or a litter of pups? says:i shall go and copy and past that comment into there nowenjoy rox, Ill talk to ya laterI have done as requested, now you all can jump down my throat and ill fnever relay the message to java as it wil only piss her off and im not going to copy and paste entire convos back and forth ona regular basis.

Who the fuck is Isophoryl or w/e