Proof God Exists

---

Originally Posted By: Rad Originally Posted By: thorComing from the bottom of the ocean? When we all DO see rivers pooring in and rain coming from above (and no springs)? I'd say most likely no. Put yourself (mentally) in their place and think on it. Back when the Bible was written, they could see rivers & rain, but no springs? Wow! I wonder why?What were those things the Bible mentions where water bubbled to the surface; where they drank and watered their animals & stuff?Not the wells, but the places where the water bubbled forth? With all the rivers endlessly pouring into the oceans, why would one assume there would be springs at the bottom too unless having seen them for ones self? Aren't springs we can see usually the source of streams and rivers rather than the end? Finally, why were we surprised to find them when we eventually got down there in today's age if what you suggest is a reasonable assumption?While not constituting irrefutable proof, one would be hard-pressed to come up with any reasonable explanation to explain it all away.

Originally Posted By: unsupervised Originally Posted By: thorIf those who believe are wrong, they lose nothing...if those who don't believe are wrong, they lose everything. that is quite astute. I've always had this mental immage of devout christains ascending to the "pearly gates" to be greeted by Vishnu... and just saing "aww shit" Either way, it's an opportunity an athiest certainly won't get.

I dunno I just don't like the concept "Well believe anyways, what do you have to lose". As a christian I find that whole statement to be disturbing. The point of religion is about faith. Believing "just incase" goes totally against the whole point of being a Christian (Or any other religion for that matter). Just claiming to be a Christian is not a golden ticket into heaven.

Originally Posted By: albeitmyselfYou can't prove there's no such thing as an invisible pink unicorn in the world. But common sense and a lack of evidence more than justifies your lack of belief in such a thing. Only if one is arrogant enough to assume that human beings are capable of detecting and understanding all there is to see and know in the universe.Atheists (and I know you don't claim to be one) are often going on about being open-minded while continually demonstrating how closed theirs actually are.

Originally Posted By: NtroducingMyselfI dunno I just don't like the concept "Well believe anyways, what do you have to lose". As a christian I find that whole statement to be disturbing. The point of religion is about faith. Believing "just incase" goes totally against the whole point of being a Christian (Or any other religion for that matter). Just claiming to be a Christian is not a golden ticket into heaven. I agree...I wasn't suggesting anybody believe "just in case".

Quote: Either way, it's an opportunity an athiest certainly won't getpossibly. I could be wrong as any of us could. I've basically lead my life according to the rules often attributed to christianity. Not because I beleive in god or fear hell. Just because it's the right thing to do as a person in a society.So, if I find myself meeting my maker, I'm guessing that my disbelief would be forgiven in light of the good in my life on earth.If I am also wrong in that assumption and this god person really is a vengeful, horrible monster that forgives nothing, then sobeit. I wouldn't want to be in a heaven with people who fit that mold anyway.

Originally Posted By: Rad
I don't even know, at this pount, if "see" means understand or view or what.
View.

Originally Posted By: thorI agree...but whatever is currently popular certainly seems to always get a lot of mileage here on this board, regardless of the subject. I guess there are those that follow and those that actually stop and think for themselves. Atheism is pretty popular these days.  Originally Posted By: thorAtheists (and I know you don't claim to be one) are often going on about being open-minded while continually demonstrating how closed theirs actually are.Atheism is growing I suppose, but what of it? I never claimed that I'm an atheist myself. I was just asking questions to the OP to see if he can truly answer what I wanted to know without loosing his cool. I can certainly think for myself when it comes to what I believe in.I grew up in a Catholic family. Went to church and Saturday school and all that jazz. It wasn't until I grew a bit older when I was able to think for myself. I started asking questions and I began to realized that no one could really give me a satisfied answer.I don't care what religion you practice. I truly have no problems with it. My problem with this thread is the OP said he wasn't trying to force his beliefs on anyone and in the end, did the opposite. And when questions were asked, he left in a huff. If enjoys reading the Bible, then great, good for him. But please, don't try to tell me there's only one right way.I think I'm a pretty open-minded person. I believe ALL religions have an equal chance in being viewed as possible. It's when people who dismiss all but one religion to be "right". That to me is pretty arrogant.

Originally Posted By: albeitmyself

I concede there is a minute possibility that something that could be termed "God" might exist. However, there is not enough empirical (read: none) evidence to satisfy me.

As for being "open-minded" - I was a Christian, a strong Christian, for the majority of my life. I've definitely become more open-minded since then.

Open-minded, to me, would (at least in part) be being able to acknowledge the possibility of the existance of something we can't, with our limited abilities as humans, find empirical evidence of. Something such as an invisible pink unicorn. :wink:

The real clincher for me is the inability of anybody being able to provide any empirical evidence in support of "natural selection" as being the motivating factor behind the process of evolution. Failing that, there must be something (or somebody) that causes evolution to happen, right? Otherwise, continued belief in "natural selection" constitutes nothing more that *gulp* faith!

One must acknowledge, in one way or another, that not all things that exist in this universe have a responsibility to provide us with empirical evidence in support of their existance.

wouldn't the fossil record count as empirical evidence? Or do you believe that god just killed off his experements and created new ones over and over and over?

oh, and just for fun this will help it all make perfect sense

Originally Posted By: thorThe real clincher for me is the inability of anybody being able to provide any empirical evidence in support of "natural selection" as being the motivating factor behind the process of evolution. Failing that, there must be something (or somebody) that causes evolution to happen, right? Otherwise, continued belief in "natural selection" constitutes nothing more that gulp faith!Quick clarification. For you personally, what do you mean when you say evolve? I'd be able to understand this argument better if you were to explain to me what the connotations of the word "evolve" are to you. By evolution do you simply mean widespread genetic mutations, or do they have to be changes that are for the better?

Originally Posted By: thor Originally Posted By: albeitmyselfYou can't prove there's no such thing as an invisible pink unicorn in the world. But common sense and a lack of evidence more than justifies your lack of belief in such a thing. Only if one is arrogant enough to assume that human beings are capable of detecting and understanding all there is to see and know in the universe.Atheists (and I know you don't claim to be one) are often going on about being open-minded while continually demonstrating how closed theirs actually are. While it might not be invisible, Obama has a pink unicorn.

Originally Posted By: thor Originally Posted By: cooldawg2Why can't atheists just believe in God? There's no harm in it and you can't go wrong especially when you die. If those who believe are wrong, they lose nothing...if those who don't believe are wrong, they lose everything. If there is a higher being similar to God, Allah, etc., I'd hope that this isn't true. It would be, in my opinion, better if he/she/it would not judge you based on whether you believed in he/she/it. I'm pretty sure most, if not all, sensible people think this way.

Look what he started!I warned.

No! Why, why, why must the good die young. Come back Cooldawg... coooommmmee baaaaack.Speaking of ! you know there's this movie coming out with Robert de Niro AND Al Pacino! I'm like... excited as a popping pop corn. That was corny. Haha get it? Corny? Pop... CORN. K I'm done. But oh yeah it's called Righteous Kill. Can't wait since I'm in love with both of them. And this is the only movie they've been in together other than Heat.

Quote: I thought it was quite amusing that someone who has just recently read the bible for the first time, has now become a missionary trying to provide proof of Gods existence amusing? You laugh at christians who would like to discuss their faith??

Quote:

I truly have no problems with it. My problem with this thread is the OP said he wasn't trying to force his beliefs on anyone and in the end, did the opposite.

He may have taken it a bit too far.. what's something you feel passionate about? Something you truly care about? what would you do if people were basically tearing it apart and laughing at you.. THEN making fun of the way you look?

We're not all divas here are we??

Can't anyone ever act like the bigger person here? Well I know some can, I've seen it. Theres just a few people here who can't.

Don't act so surprised. It's normal.But I remember when I read the story of Lazarus being raised from the dead. And the 10 lepers healed. And the man whose sight was healed. And the woman with the blood condition. And Peter walking on water. I would not shut up. I think I memorized those stories by heart I read them so much.

I'm not surprised. I just wish some people would take that step and zip it.. be the bigger person.