Died..

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I don't think ANYONE here doesn't feel for the parents. Not even Chance or Scotty. They are just pointing out how much parenting is a HUGE responsibility. I/they, know the parents hearts are torn out. Their point is, that something could/should have been done to prevent it. Maybe I am an over protective mom, but my kids, are NEVER allowed in the water without me unless we are in a public pool with life guards...and even then I am nervous. I know the parents are hurting. Just, they should have been there...And they will hurt for a lifetime because of that.

I know that. and that's what I've been trying to tell them. I've gone through two weeks of people badgering the parents about every little thing. but that's not what I'm in the mood to hear when my friend's little sister died. no. maybe it's because I'm still mad bitter about it. but I didn't like the fact everyone kept talking about the parents this and that like I didn't know that already. next chapter, how to support the family and help them continue their lives.

I think some people are forgetting that we all do things we shouldn't. Whether these parents were habitually neglectful and selfish I don't know. I do know that even the best parents can have lapses. It's a very hard job being a parent and it's harsh to blame a parent for occasionally taking their eye off their child. It's especially difficult, as sdp pointed out, where there are lots of people splashing about in a pool.Often at parties like this one particular person acts as lifeguard.Also, though some parents go beyond the acceptable in exposing their children to risk, it's not being a good parent to be over-protective and keep the risk at zero. Community standards in this respect have changed - I read a newspaper article in which the elderly author mentioned that from six years old he was allowed to go to the beach (a bay beach a couple of blocks away) on his own. Nowadays that would probably get your children taken away from you. We now, I think, have gone a bit too far in the other direction, and are sometimes rearing children in cotton-wool who can't cope well with the real world. But if we do not avoid all risk, sometimes the worst will happen - that's what risk means.And whether or not the parents deserve any blame, they can surely still have deep sympathy. The idea that humans are either goodies or baddies, and if baddies then they deserve no sympathy or to be treated as fellow-humans, is one I find abominable. If people are to be divided into goodies and baddies, then we are all baddies.

I love you! lol... but no... thank you.

Where were the parents?

Guess you didn't read though the posts....

_the people throwing the party were giving the parents a tour of the house and they told they're eldest son who was about 17 or 18 to look after his two little sisters and brother till they got back. _

So they let an 8 year old girl go swim in a pool with no adult supervision??

"Ok darling who can't swim very good, all the parents are going for a walk in this huge house where we can't see the pool, you go play in the water and we'll be down after we're done..."

Travesty. Accountability? Sympathy? Judgment? Bickering? My what makes the world go 'round.

*sdp, just responding to the quote...

That is so wrong and completely uncalled for!Its "who can't swim very well." Not "very good."

I dont think Abi really wants to read another post talking about how the parents "should have done this, and should have done that"

For myself, I went out of my way to say that it "doesn't make them bad people". I have no reason to and I don't think they are bad people and while I do have sympathy, I find it hard to have to much sympathy for something so easily preventable.The difference here is we're not talking about a parent who's paying the cashier and turns around to find the kid gone or a kid who falls out the pick-up window while grandpa is feeding cattle or a kid who's playing in the front room and pulls a heavy piece of furniture over on their self. We're talking about parents who were busy socializing and let a small child who couldn't swim go into a pool without adult supervision. A pool is a dangerous place, which is why many municipalities require them to be fenced to certain specs. Further, the parents didn't even take the time or have the forethought to put a life vest or even floaties on the kid, if she was found at the bottom of the pool, which was apparently the case. No vest on a kid a that can't swim.With all the warnings and constant stories we here about water safety and unnecessary deaths by drowning that kind of lapse in judgement is, to a point, inexcusable. The most basic of precautions (a life vest for a child who can't swim), for whatever reason, were ignored. So, I unapologetically have little sympathy for the parents.

I feel bad for the parents, I do have sympathy for them, they suffered teh worst thing a parent can endure and that is the loss of a child. Im sick for them.I do however still blame them.If the 17 year old kid agreed to watch the children swim, and they fekt they could trust him, I blame him.I let my kids do alot of dangerous shit. But Im there, I knwo whats going on and Im skilled at navigating the danger.I have taken them up the side of a 300 foot cliff. I double check all the knots, I secure triple protection at each point. I climb first and then allow them to follow from a top rope and I belay. Iv had them in lakes and pools, and rivers. But I watch them like a fucking hawk, and we dont go into the water in spring run off or into the fast water. If we are rafting they have life jackets on, when they take the raft out on the lake alone Im on the shore watching, and they have life jackets and are both great swimmers. They have been swimming since they were about 4 or 5 and always with trusted adults or myself.raising a child requires vigilance. You cant shelter them from life and its risks and a life with no risk is a pretty shit life, but you can still let them take risks and have responsability with out keeping them in danger or atleast lessening the risk factor. No matter how rude, how politically incorrect, I stand with the bums and point a finger. a lief was dashed and stolen, its sure as hell someones fault.

See what lack of sleep will get you -- terrible grammar; that's my fault :).And...I know she may not want to read another post about how it's the parents fault etc. but my one post regarding it is no more degrading to the thread as all the posts regarding stillsearching's. As it seems to have ended, so shall my involvement in it.

i understand you meant well regarding the topic though. its just i know it was upsetting her hearing about how it was the parent's fault. my apologizes

It's quite alright, no need to apologize. As terrible as these threads are -- or death in general; I can't help but show the same amount of sympathy as oldfolks and gravity and to a far extent, possibly helmsman. I hate to see death show its face to such young people but this doesn't seem to parallel such cases like starving children dying tens of thousand at a time in a poverty stricken country. That's an extreme but for ME it puts things in perspective. Whether or not it coincides with the rest of the forums and its members, to be honest I don't care in that regard. The fact is death is not a fun thing to discuss especially in instances such as this. guess my involvement got extended a few more sentences.

oh no don't worry ash I'm done. they still don't get it but it's all good, homie, lol. Ilegible calmed me down and helped me understand a little better so I thank him very much for that.

What don't I get? Explain it.

Are you saying you know they fucked up in a big, bad, ugly, horrendous way but are trying to figure out how to help them get passed it?

If that's what your asking I don't know that there is a way. I think it's something they will have to come to terms with all by themselves, not even as a couple but as individual human beings.

You know who's going to really have a hard time dealing with this? The brother who was supposed to be watching her. Can you imagine the guilt this kid is having? That's enough to scar him for life and potentially drive him to depression and other problems.

Thats actually a good point. Could you imagine that he got really depressed and went online looking for a place to help him, then he finds A2A and reads this thread...

I'm sorry, I'm done trying to explain because everytime I try to get through, you guys push your steadfast and unwavering points without a second thought. you all say the exact same thing. like I didn't get it the first 5 times. and I honestly don't want to get upset again. so thanks anyway.

Originally Posted By: OldFolksWhat don't I get? Explain it. Are you saying you know they fucked up in a big, bad, ugly, horrendous way but are trying to figure out how to help them get passed it?I'll explain it.What you and a lot of others here don't get is that they did NOT "fuck up in a big, bad, ugly, horrendous way"...... They made a mistake; doesn't that simply make them human beings?I frankly find a lot of the attitudes expressed in this post to be enormously disturbing, if not utterly disgusting. Sometimes horrible things happen; and it is not always due to gross misconduct. One needs to have some damn sense of proportion where moral outrage is concerned, and some sense of compassion as well. This level of outrage might make sense for an intentional abuser; it doesn't in the case of a tragedy like this. It's not like these parents threw their kid in a lake, or locked her in a car or abused her. It was a horrible accident of a type that happens occasionally. It does not seem grossly irresponsible to me that that they asked a 17 year old to watch her. And ok- he was careless and it resulted in a tragedy. But tragedies happen sometimes. I cannot believe that they can be entirely eliminated.These parents and surely the teen brother will blame themselves for ever for this tragedy. The loss of this child is horrible, and they'll all suffer enormously- maybe even enough to satisfy you heartless, compassionless bastards.What the fuck is wrong with people in this culture that people have become this damn punitive? This all reminds me of a bizarre case that happened in my community when a child died in a really freakish accident, and a teenage baby sitter was wrongly blamed and sent to prison for decades for it- until an appeals court set her free-- too long a story. But the point is we've all become so brutally god-damned punitive at some point whether it's merited or not. Save this kind of outrage for those who deliberately kill their children, and have some damned compassion for those who simply made a human mistake and are suffering for it.One more thing: Abi seems to be a remarkably bright and sweet teen- one of the really fine people in this world. She was obviously traumatized by this experience, and these rantings against the parents of this drowned child were NOT what she needed. How about some empathy and compassion for her instead?